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wasted potential

RP - Thank you for the Congrats! You are correct in stating that the Christian vote turned out big-time for the President and made the difference. It wasn't the secularist MTV crowd, it wasn't the disgruntled union workers, it wasn't the Bush haters of the far left - it was all those dimwitted Christian Evangelical voters:)

Unlike you, I suppose, I was heartened to see the numbers of my fellow evangelicals not only voting for Bush, but working as unpaid volunteers. The energy on the ground was amazing and contagious!

What is probably the most gauling to the left is that this President, their most hated one in memory, received more votes nationwide than any other in the history of our country. It wasn't all evangelicals either, but catholics, military personnel, irreligious parents of school aged children and conservative minded voters of all kinds. You don't get that many votes with just the Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson crowd!

Anyway, I feel for you. If the shoe was on the other foot, I would have been very depressed today indeed.

L.D.S. Laura

I don't know where you get your information, but here on earth the networks were all reporting the early exit polls for Kerry and the market went down. They went DOWN when it looked like Kerry was going to win, not the other way around. I like the way you libs twist everything, including the facts, to try to fit your way of thinking. However, we conservatives are paying attention and we know what really happened. Nice try. Then you try to explain away the fact that the market and economy are going to do well under Bush in spite of the experts. Apparently you know better than the experts in that field. NOT. We have the facts on our side. You might want to reevaluate your stand since libs can't win an election based on the far left (waco) stand. We have shown that to be true over and over. When are you going to get the message??? The people of America want a president with a moral core, who will keep them safe, and does what is best for the country, not what the polls tell them will get them elected.

wasted potential

Phoenician - What country are you from if you are not from the US?

jbreaux0302

Agreed wasted like i said I am from louisiana and catholics as myself are the majority here and PRESIDENT BUSH carred louisiana big. Rocket I have enjoyed reading your post over this election and if the shoe was on the other foot I dont know if i would have gotten out of the bed today so I do feel for you. I just pray we can all put this behind us and come together and show the rest of the world we are united. If nothing else then for our troops.

Henry Schlatman

jbreaux0302,
While Bush may have won the election, "We the People" own this two party political system we call "Our Government." Ideally, it works by the Democrats taking the far left of an issue and the Republicans taking the extreme right on the same issue. Therefore, "Our Government" works best if "We the People" allow the "Both Sides" to speak out freely against any issue. And it is the American Citizens right to contact their elected representive to have their vioce heard.

Therefore, if the true republicans like yourself really want to show the world that America is united you will shout up Rush and Hannity for they do not help your cause. No, your party now has to prove it can govern without surpressing the vioces of the Independent and Democart Voter. Remember, a 3% or 4 million vote difference in the vote does not mean Bush has a mandate.

P.S.
I was always taught that "My God" believed in telling the "Real Truth" above all.

L.D.S. Laura

Henry, what?????? I don't understand what your point is. Did you have one????

Therefore, "Our Government" works best if "We the People" allow the "Both Sides" to speak out freely against any issue. Then you say we need to shut Rush and Hannity up???? Is that your point? I got lost in your paragraph looking for a point.

Bill Evans

Shut Up Rush and Hannity? Why not get some left wingnuts to explain the screwed up ideas of the liberals? AirAmerica Radio tries but they are awful. They have nothing but whining and complaining about what is wrong with no idea about how to fix a problem.

They have nothing good to say about anything; they blame America first for everything, and think that we deserved the attack on 9/11 because we are evil.

You think that's a winning formula? Please continue to make the same mistakes ad infinitum and the libs will go the way of the Whigs.

GWB-2004

Rocket Punch, Just like I have been saying for almost a year now. Kerry got smoked and he can finally shut up

Henry Schlatman

L.D.S. Laura,
Rush, Hannity and others like Ann Coltier have made millions making conservatives believe that anyone who has a liberal (real idea of change) view of our nation growing up as a society is somehow Ungodly. Now that they have succeeded in taking over "We the People's Government" lets find out good America really is.

Rush keeps saying that he has an ear for God, well we keep hearing that "America is the best country in the World" Now can Bush and the Republican Party deliver on the BS they have been talking for the last 10 years. JUDGEMENT DAY is here for the REPUBLICAN PARTY which has made the claim that No One should be a slave. In the coming days and years, Our Nation will see if they can live up to them delivering our society from Economic Slavery.

Henry Schlatman

Bill Evans,
Yes, Rush and Hannity is a wasted potential of the republican right wing. How do you thibk this country got so divided? For the last ten years all we have heard out of either of them is how bad the liberals are in this country. Not once have I ever heard them debate the real issues of the day with anyone of self-respect. In fact, we seen this election that when faced with the truth, they could only lie.

No, if the real republicans of this country want to stay a party they will sunset Rush and Hannity and jion the rest of the country in finding an honest way to solve the problems this country faces. Being Humble is not a show of Weakness, but a Stand of Self Knowledge ans Strength.

dem2004

I'm a Democrat and a proud one at that. Although I fully supported Kerry, we lost. At the very least we, as Democrats, should evaluate what went wrong and make some changes. I congratulate the Republicans and their organizers for a job well done. They deserve it today.

But I think it is also important to recognize that no matter where you stand today, there is a divided country, no doubt about it. Liberals can talk about winning America back and Conservatives can talk about restoring tradition to America, but when it comes down to it there are two views in this country that have to be heard. The agenda of one is not the agenda of all and I hope both Republicans AND Democrats will remember that as they craft legislation and work towards their goals.

Incessant whining (DEMs), over-gloating (REPs) and divisive name-calling will get this country nowhere. It never has and it never will.

op

Tucker,

You guys did a great job. The president won because of your hard work on his behalf. Now we will have four more years of Bush and Kerry will join the heap of loser in the history of doomed from the start presidential campaigns. This board is so much nicer without the libs.

Phoenician in a time of Romans

Rush keeps saying that he has an ear for God, well we keep hearing that "America is the best country in the World"

The best countries in the world do not torture prisoners.

lewis

It amazes me that RP is so afraid of Christians because that fear gives validation to why Christians perceive that Democrats are contemptious of their faith.Democrats come across as arrogant and out of touch the moment the discussion shifts to values.Their kind of elitist,Eastern approach to their party is devastating to them in the South,Midwest,and West.They have lost touch with blue collar America as they reached out to the yuppies with their upper-middle-class liberalism.To appeal to middle America they must shed their inhibition about talking about faith and work more with religious groups

Henry Schlatman

lewis,
It has been a time honored tradition for our political leaders to keep their religous views personal. By Bush and the Republican party keeping pushing their "Chirstianity" on the rest of the nation's political field, they are setting up this country for a debate that you do not want. Before you and the rest of the Americans in the "Red" states serve up your beliefs and morals in God, you better to be able to handle the truth.

lewis

Henry your assertion is far from reality, heck all you have to do is read our founding documents.Thank goodness we are free to all practice our religious beliefs ,or lack of them ,as we see fit even Democrats , Reps.and Presidents. Ain't freedom grand.

RocketPunch

lewis - how typical of you to use the word elitist - the new label word for opposing thoughts. There is nothing elitist about preferring a study of faith that doesn't feel a need to intertwine with politics. As someone with a gay parent, there is nothing elitist about seeing the hurt in my mothers eyes when she sees that 11 out of 11 states came out in record numbers to restrict her rights as an American to support their moral agenda. I know there are many Christians who have an open mind to the lives of others, but those people weren't in the majority force that came out to support "God in the White House". It hurts, lewis. It isn't about politics, it is about the lives of other people and the way our country looks down on them. No, I am not elitist, I am a realist. You feel justified in your opinions because Bush won but that doesn't wash away the facts.

Linda

Many christian conservatives have compassion for gay people. No one wants to take their rights away. But marriage is between a man and a woman. No one is saying two gay people can't commit to each other just as a man and a woman committed to each other aren't forced to marry. They are free to live with each other in an unmarried state. But only a man and a woman can honor that committment with marriage. Like it or not it is one of the founding principles of this country. Just because the minority screams the loudest, does the majority have to grant their every wish? It is the will of the people - get over it.

RocketPunch

Get over it? I would love for you to come over here and tell my mother, who has been with her partner for 12 years to "get over it". Yes, that is compassion Linda. You've proven your point. It's so easy for you to spout that out to other people, isn't it? Founding principles? Great Majority? Why don't we bring back slavery? Let's ban woman from voting? Bring back separate water fountains for blacks! You want this country to founded on Christian beliefs? Why don't we go back to the Crusades ... or are we already working on that. Hey! Let's hunt down those witches and burn them at the stake. In the immortal words of Pope Gregory VII - "Cursed be the man who holds back his sword from shedding blood."

Don't be so confused that you believe a majority vote makes something morally correct. Change always has resistance but it always wins out in the end.

L.D.S. Laura

Those who forget history (or don't really study it) are doomed to repeat it. You obviously don't understand history. If the majority of Americans had wanted slavery to continue, it would have. The mojority would not have gone to war for the North if they thought slavery was right. If the majority of Americans really wanted to go back to segragation they would elect people to reenact segragation. They would put judges in office to uphold their decisions. The fact is, the majority of Americans believe in the Constitution and the rights of minorities. What they DON'T opted by the liberal left. Most conservitives, while being against gay marriage, believe civil unions are the way to go. Gay people SAY all they really want are the same protections as straight people within the law. Well if that's what they REALLY want then they won't put up a fight about civil unions. Civil unions give them the legal protections they claim they want while still protection the sanctity of marriage. You should stop bashing religion and start trying to get along.

RocketPunch

I'll say it again

Change always has resistance but it always wins out in the end.

Banning slavery wasn't always supported by the popular vote. Women's rights, desegregation, etc. weren't always supported by the popular vote.
This is all a part of a history you claim I don't understand. We might be in the voting minority right now but that will not always be the case. No matter how much a conservative view tries to resist change, mankind will always evolve in everything from science to cultural beliefs.

And before you are so quick to praise Civil Unions as an acceptable way to keep you from looking like a bigot, you might want to take a look at some of the things people actually voted on this week.

"Ohioans on Tuesday backed up the nation's toughest law banning gay marriage with an even broader constitutional amendment against civil unions."



Henry Schlatman

Linda,
While marriage between a man and a women may be stated in the "Old Testiment" of the bible, I want you to prove that our founding fathers gave any of our governments the right to regulate in the constitution. The facts are that our fore fathers seen marriage as a religous matter and the first marriage lisence was issued in America uniformly in 1928.

Please check out history on this pastors web site.
http://www.mercyseat.net/BROCHURES/marriagelicense.htm

wasted potential

Actually, the most clear passage on the Biblical view of homosexuality comes from Romans 1 in the New Testament. However, the goal of Christianity is to convert non-believers to our side through persuasive arguments and faith, not enforcement through the government.

What traditional Americans (Christian and others alike) have been feeling since 1968 is that small, far-left groups in this country have taken over much of the social agenda of the democratic party. This is why the Democrats have lost the south for several elections, at the state level, Congress and the Whitehouse. Democrats cannot grasp this as they continue to put candidates out that are obviously secular in their point of view and have to fake the whole "God" thing during an election.

President Clinton was the last national democratic figure who understood this and was persuasive in communicating to the traditionalists that he understood and respected their point of view. What the exit polls showed is that many people, myself included, would never vote for any candidate that supports partial birth abortion and the homosexual agenda. This is irregardless of where they stand on any other issue.

No one disagrees that homosexuals, asexuals and heterosexuals have the right to sleep with, live with whomever they want. However, to those of the Judeo-Christian tradition, marriage is a sacred institution, given to us by the creator, as between a man and a woman. It established the familty, the core basic component of our civilization where procreation, nurturing, instruction and raising of children takes place. It is not merely a tax code provision or insurance beneficiary issue. That is why it strikes such a cord in the "retro" areas.

The "metro" areas are far more secular in their population and as such do not hold marriage in the same regard. They view it more of a governmental recognition of rights for life insurance benefits, tax filings, as well as an affirmation of the love two people have for each other, but the creator does not figure into that equation. "what's the big deal?" they ask.

The question itself reaffirms the traditionalists belief that the democrats truly do not understand their way of life anymore and so they continue to vote Republican more and more.

A final note: If the Republican party were to ever nominate a pro-choice candidate for President, then the democrats would win the election. I say this because many are hyping Guiliani as the next great candidate. He is a great speaker and a great leader. However, his view on abortion would kill the energy on the right, his GOTV efforts would fail and he would lose. I would not vote for president in an election like that, unless the democrat or a 3rd party candidate was pro-life. Then I would vote for them.

Anyway, very long winded and I have to get back to work. Just wanted to try and clarify where we in the red states are coming from on social issues and the democrat party.

Linda

RP

I am sure your mother and her partner are very lovely people. They have been together for longer than some heterosexual couples. But it doesn't change the fact that this country does not want to recognize gay marriage. It is a reality you have to face. Try and change it all you want, that is your freedom to do. But I don't see it happening in our lifetime. And what your mother is going through really doesn't compare to slavery, a truly hideous blemish on our country's past.

rls

Dem2004 and evryone else:
I am an Independent and an Athiest and a Liberal. I voted for GWB because of his character and integrity. He says what he means and he does what he says. His policies do not change regardless of the political winds. Whether you agree with his position or not-you know what his position is and you can take it to the bank.

The Donkey party is in denial. Denial of the fact that they are the MINORITY. Denial of the fact that 90% of the populace agree with the Liberal Agenda - just not with the methods the Liberals use to advance it. Denial of the fact that Mainstream America is SOOOOOOO different from the coastal & academia Liberal culture. We share the same goals - just not the same values.

The Dems MUST rercognize that their party cannot be dominated by the Coasts & elitist snobs that consider mainstream America to be dumb religious fanatics. Just because I do not have a God - that doesn't mean others that do are idiots. I DO NOT fear repression from the religious community. I have the protection of the Constitution - which is designed to protect the INDIVIDUAL from the tyranny of the government and the tyranny of the majority.

I want the Democrat Party to continue to exist - I want them to promote their ideas - I want a healthy, respectful debate over the ideas of the left and the right. The problem is that the Dems seem not to recognize that their party is NOT the party of Michael Moore and the culture of the elite. Their party is the party of the liberal agenda. Their party historically is the party that advances the concept of "equality" - in all areas, such as, religion, economics, education and health services. I think they owe it to me, and people like me, to advance a candidate that I could consider voting for.

There is no reason that decent people, with difference of opinion, cannot have a respectful debate on the issues. This vitriolic hysteria coming out of the fringes of both sides simply does not advance the agenda of either side. My condolences to the Democrats on their election loss-it is their own fault because of the candidate that they fielded. And because of that, we ALL suffer some from that loss.

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